Post by Izzetafox on Dec 16, 2015 12:12:34 GMT
Please bear with me tis is going to be a long post but hopefully you will understand why there may be links between SWKA and my negotiations with Anglian Water on access and how it may help with new waters. Mark has told me there are some fears being raised in the community so here goes........
It seems things have got a bit mixed up. I have held back on going fully public on the agreement until AWA confirm everything.
Let me just explain their side of things......initially Anglian Water wanted Rutland Water access for kayaks to be governed by the Watersports Centre as we are kayakers. We would then have to comply with the following rules:
......
Members may not paddle on the Main Body unless they are accompanied by a person who has been approved to lead on the Main Body. The Main Body Leaders will sign directly in and out at Rutland Watersports using their RCC Photo ID card. To lead on the Main Body the person must be over the age of eighteen, hold a BCU 3 Star Qualification, hold a current Canoe Safety Test and hold a current First Aid qualification recognised by the BCU. The person must be approved to lead on the Main Body by the Club Committee with the guidance of the Safety Officer. The Committee may require proof of qualifications. Groups going onto the Main Body must always carry the following equipment: Smoke Flares, Split Paddles, Tow Line, First Aid Kit, Mobile Phone or VHF radio.
.........
It took some arguing that we are the equivalent of solo anglers on a boat. The Watersports manager is resistant to this. Jon Marshall (Anglian's Fisheries Manager) has agreed to take my view. BUT his H&S Team still want some control over access and almost everything they do on this topic is negotiated with 'clubs'.
They insisted that they would only grant access to a Kayak Angling Club. I spent some time researching creating a new club. However with the hassle of writing a constitution, electing chairman, secretary, treasurer and committee along with a bank account and insurance I held back on starting from scratch.
Then at Loch Ken I approached Ed to see if SWKA would consider helping. Going down this route SWKA 'PAID UP' members would have access. As members they would automatically have insurance. A big plus also is that any 'meets' arranged would also be covered.
So you will see that this already makes access to Rutland less complicated just by being a club member. Rutland are very happy with this and they have seen SWKAs credentials as the only club in the UK.
To put the whole 'competence' issue into perspective.....the subject was raised by a kayaker when we first went in January. He go in on my talks with Jon on the shoreline. His comments were ' You must make sure kayak anglers are competent. SWKA membership is a far better alternative. AWA are prepared to accept membership as a demonstration of responsibility and competence.
Everyone has to understand that when dealing with Rutland Water you are actually dealing with Anglian Water and the whole corporation behind them and a phrase that keeps coming up is ' Anglian Water have a corporate liability and a duty of care'. The SWKA route seems to be ticking their boxes.
It took me 5 years to get Ravensthorpe as a trial and then Pitsford, Rutland being so big and wild at times was always going to be tougher. Ultimately it is not down to the Rangers on any of the waters to grant access it is Jon Marshall land the whole AW set up. So yes ultimately all AW access may be restricted to SWKA members.
Going forward as I see it, others will disagree, negotiating access to waters may be easier as a club. Yes some private waters will be fine with individuals but many clubs or public authorities will have the same responsibilities as Anglian. So approaching as a club may give more leverage especially when Anglian is used as a reference.
Looking at some of the bigger clubs it may be that they will not give individual access but they may consider giving SWKA 'affiliate' membership. I may be completely wrong but so many waters are refusing us for silly reasons based on their history with random paddlers upsetting anglers. But as a kayak angling club it gives us an air professionalism which may open doors.
It should be understood that this is not for existing waters but for new waters that want some assurances from us. You must realise that currently there are people going on Rav and Pits that have no insurance and that is against the most basic rules Anglian want applying. Plus as I say any meet that is organised through a forum must by law be insured. NWKF stopped all meets because of this so going forward SWKA membership is a massive benefit. You as a club official must be aware of the clubs liabilities for people fishing your waters. More and more boxes are having to be ticked and SWKA membership does this.
Problems I have been encountering is kayak anglers who have just fished club waters with any consent or consultation. This has upset members and committees. By making an approach as a club for our club to have access it gives us more credence. Too many kayak anglers are doing the 'I'll give it a try' and leave clubs thinking we are all like that. They are breaking the law and the Angling Trust are telling the clubs this.
Most coarse anglers will know that to get access to many, many waters now you have to be in a club. Most coarse anglers are used to this. The salties however do not appreciate how restrictive freshwater access can be. Some of them totally ignore this as you will have seen on FB and forums with some of the catch reports that people have fished some water without consent or research.
I have received a number of messages from lads about access negotiations and many have said that club status could be helpful, in fact there have often been posts on forums about creating a club. My opinion was why not use the reputation and expertise that SWKA already have.
I hope this helps to clear up any questions you guys may have.
I will keep you all updated as things progress. I am happy to answers any questions that arise from this post.
Terry
It seems things have got a bit mixed up. I have held back on going fully public on the agreement until AWA confirm everything.
Let me just explain their side of things......initially Anglian Water wanted Rutland Water access for kayaks to be governed by the Watersports Centre as we are kayakers. We would then have to comply with the following rules:
......
Members may not paddle on the Main Body unless they are accompanied by a person who has been approved to lead on the Main Body. The Main Body Leaders will sign directly in and out at Rutland Watersports using their RCC Photo ID card. To lead on the Main Body the person must be over the age of eighteen, hold a BCU 3 Star Qualification, hold a current Canoe Safety Test and hold a current First Aid qualification recognised by the BCU. The person must be approved to lead on the Main Body by the Club Committee with the guidance of the Safety Officer. The Committee may require proof of qualifications. Groups going onto the Main Body must always carry the following equipment: Smoke Flares, Split Paddles, Tow Line, First Aid Kit, Mobile Phone or VHF radio.
.........
It took some arguing that we are the equivalent of solo anglers on a boat. The Watersports manager is resistant to this. Jon Marshall (Anglian's Fisheries Manager) has agreed to take my view. BUT his H&S Team still want some control over access and almost everything they do on this topic is negotiated with 'clubs'.
They insisted that they would only grant access to a Kayak Angling Club. I spent some time researching creating a new club. However with the hassle of writing a constitution, electing chairman, secretary, treasurer and committee along with a bank account and insurance I held back on starting from scratch.
Then at Loch Ken I approached Ed to see if SWKA would consider helping. Going down this route SWKA 'PAID UP' members would have access. As members they would automatically have insurance. A big plus also is that any 'meets' arranged would also be covered.
So you will see that this already makes access to Rutland less complicated just by being a club member. Rutland are very happy with this and they have seen SWKAs credentials as the only club in the UK.
To put the whole 'competence' issue into perspective.....the subject was raised by a kayaker when we first went in January. He go in on my talks with Jon on the shoreline. His comments were ' You must make sure kayak anglers are competent. SWKA membership is a far better alternative. AWA are prepared to accept membership as a demonstration of responsibility and competence.
Everyone has to understand that when dealing with Rutland Water you are actually dealing with Anglian Water and the whole corporation behind them and a phrase that keeps coming up is ' Anglian Water have a corporate liability and a duty of care'. The SWKA route seems to be ticking their boxes.
It took me 5 years to get Ravensthorpe as a trial and then Pitsford, Rutland being so big and wild at times was always going to be tougher. Ultimately it is not down to the Rangers on any of the waters to grant access it is Jon Marshall land the whole AW set up. So yes ultimately all AW access may be restricted to SWKA members.
Going forward as I see it, others will disagree, negotiating access to waters may be easier as a club. Yes some private waters will be fine with individuals but many clubs or public authorities will have the same responsibilities as Anglian. So approaching as a club may give more leverage especially when Anglian is used as a reference.
Looking at some of the bigger clubs it may be that they will not give individual access but they may consider giving SWKA 'affiliate' membership. I may be completely wrong but so many waters are refusing us for silly reasons based on their history with random paddlers upsetting anglers. But as a kayak angling club it gives us an air professionalism which may open doors.
It should be understood that this is not for existing waters but for new waters that want some assurances from us. You must realise that currently there are people going on Rav and Pits that have no insurance and that is against the most basic rules Anglian want applying. Plus as I say any meet that is organised through a forum must by law be insured. NWKF stopped all meets because of this so going forward SWKA membership is a massive benefit. You as a club official must be aware of the clubs liabilities for people fishing your waters. More and more boxes are having to be ticked and SWKA membership does this.
Problems I have been encountering is kayak anglers who have just fished club waters with any consent or consultation. This has upset members and committees. By making an approach as a club for our club to have access it gives us more credence. Too many kayak anglers are doing the 'I'll give it a try' and leave clubs thinking we are all like that. They are breaking the law and the Angling Trust are telling the clubs this.
Most coarse anglers will know that to get access to many, many waters now you have to be in a club. Most coarse anglers are used to this. The salties however do not appreciate how restrictive freshwater access can be. Some of them totally ignore this as you will have seen on FB and forums with some of the catch reports that people have fished some water without consent or research.
I have received a number of messages from lads about access negotiations and many have said that club status could be helpful, in fact there have often been posts on forums about creating a club. My opinion was why not use the reputation and expertise that SWKA already have.
I hope this helps to clear up any questions you guys may have.
I will keep you all updated as things progress. I am happy to answers any questions that arise from this post.
Terry
